More insane ROEs getting ready to be put upon our troops? - "DOD to study how crimes against civilians downrange are handled"

[Twana Blevins]

When I first read this, my initial thought was, they are getting ready to finish off our troops with more insanity they will call ROE's. They have already tied their hands and feet in these battles in this war, now they are hog tying them.

Note there are two posts here. The top one is 8 days old and the second is what they used to do this.

Twana

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Stars and Stripes

Penned By Jennifer Hlad

Published: August 3, 2012

 

WASHINGTON — The Pentagon has appointed a group of civilians and retired officers to review how military justice has been applied in cases that resulted in the death, injury or abuse of civilians in Iraq or Afghanistan, to determine if there are ways to improve the system, defense officials said Friday.

“We know that, over the last 10 years in Iraq and Afghanistan, bad things have happened involving combat excesses and innocent civilians in deployed areas,” Defense Secretary Leon Panetta wrote in a memo about the group, a subcommittee of the newly created Defense Legal Policy Board.

“The abuses have been rare among our professional fighting force, but they became huge flash points that threatened to undermine our entire mission and the foundation of our relationship with the host government and its people. Thus, for offenses that take place in a country in which we operate alongside the civilian population, it is critical that our system of military justice be efficient, fair, dependable and credible,”

The 11-member group will not review allegations of detainee abuse or incidents of friendly fire or civilian deaths related to lawful military operations, Defense General Counsel Jeh Johnson said. It also will not pass judgment on the results of particular cases or any ongoing cases or investigations.

Panetta created the group as part of his “ongoing interest in accountability, particularly in deployed areas,” Johnson said. “There was no one case which motivates this. We just think it’s worth looking into.”

The subcommittee will not re-litigate old cases, Pentagon press secretary George Little added.

“This is about a strategic look at the military justice system and looking forward, and what improvements we may need to make to function even better in the future,” Little said.

The review will include assessing the way offenses are reported and investigated, whether there are ways to improve cooperation with local law enforcement, whether military justice in deployed settings protects the rights of the accused and the rights and needs of victims and witnesses, and whether military justice in deployed areas should be handled jointly rather than within individual services.

“I am prepared to be told by this group that, for the most part, the application of military justice is working well, or, that here are some improvements that could be made, perhaps drawing from the civilian criminal justice system,” Johnson said.

The Defense Legal Policy Board was established at the end of April and appointed at the end of July. The subcommittee is the board’s first assignment, Johnson said.

The subcommittee has 210 days — about seven months — for the review.

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Los Angeles Times
Criminal charges dismissed against soldier in Afghanistan shooting

By Kim Murphy
August 9, 2012, 5:09 p.m. (Pacific)

Criminal charges were dismissed Thursday against U.S. Army  Sgt. 1st Class Walter Taylor, who had faced potential imprisonment for negligent homicide in the 2011 death of a civilian doctor in Afghanistan.

Col. Darren L. Werner, commander of the 16th Sustainment Brigade in Bamberg, Germany, released a charge sheet dismissing all counts after an investigating officer found that there was insufficient evidence to support the charges.

The case has sparked widespread debate over the Army’s rules of engagement in Afghanistan, which now require soldiers to positively establish that a target is a non-civilian with hostile intent before using their weapons. Rarely in the past have service members faced homicide charges for split-second decisions made in the heat of combat.

The case has sparked widespread debate over the Army’s rules of engagement in Afghanistan, which now require soldiers to positively establish that a target is a non-civilian with hostile intent before using their weapons. Rarely in the past have service members faced homicide charges for split-second decisions made in the heat of combat.

Taylor, 31, has said he had only seconds to decide whether an unidentified figure emerging from a car near a shootout with insurgents was about to detonate another bomb. The shootout had erupted after a roadside bomb seriously injured five other soldiers.

As it happened, the person he fatally shot was the head of the obstetrics department at a nearby hospital, returning with her family from a wedding.

“It’s not just a victory for me, it’s a victory for all the soldiers,” Taylor said in an interview Thursday. “For all the soldiers that did great things down range [in Afghanistan]. They don’t have to think in their mind that one of their comrades was being done wrong.”

http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-afghan-shooti...

H/T Beverly Perlson (Band of Mothers) for this bottom post.

[Twana Blevins]

reserved for updates

[Cathy Gardino]

Losing three outstanding and mature military men this week...in the 3rd attack of "blue on green" violence this week...

Running the war and training, suiting and booting the enemy...The approach is wrong, and we appear to be "stupid" as the enemy is the white house hosts another ramadan dinner...

 

Romney-Ryan 2012-2020

[Fred Fleming]

If this is the mentality of Panetta and his lackies in the Pentagon, then we had better bring multiple murder charges against all of the living B-17, B-24 and B-29 pilots who dropped bombs in Europe and Japan during World War II.  Many civilians were killed during those raids.  Hey Panetta, wars have consequences.  Why don't you suit up in combat gear and go out and do 'point' on a patrol or two, then come back and tell the grunts how to fight a war.  Only after you have lead by example should you tell the ones in harm's way how to do their job.  But then I forgot that you are just a typical elitist politician living on the government teat, with no real world experience telling business and the military how to do their job while never having done either job.

[Dorris Ponstingl]

This is far beyond my comprehension, When a man creates as many crimes against a country as Barack Obama has and they still are letting him set in the Oval office, Something isn't adding up.

It would't be a bad Idea to put Barack in the ARMY for at least 4 years, and see what a difference that would do to his additude toward our SERVICE MEN.

Do we really have that many Socialist and Marxist in our Government?????????I think it is time for the talking to stop and start action on this whole regime.(before the election)Now that is  when you use the word SHOVEL READY!!!

 

Who is sleeping at the wheel??? Will the American people have to get together and do like other countries to oust out the Leaders? but of course If we really start to clean house, for people in the know that would entail removing at least 70% of the SENATE and  35% of CONGRESS. That would cut down on Government Spending.Now there is a good Idea,they haven't thought of that ,if they had it would have been done Right??????????

I don't think we have an awful lot Politician we can trust, and  when the new get in they become Corrupt in no time.It is just an on going game.We just have to keep the radar on them all the time.You know what, I'll bet there wont be that many run fro office if they knew that.

WE have to find a new system,in order to hold office in any part of our Government they have to be put under a microscope going back to the date of their birth. And all of the When, Where and Hows of every aspect of their lives.

I don't know about you but I am tired of people like this whole regime thinking we are STUPID enough to believe every word that comes from their lying mouth.

We have to many who is in our Government  they aren't working for America anyway.It is  for their EGO'S and BANK ACCOUNTS that drive them to run for office.

They forget who put them in Office,and why they were put there.

[Robert James Burkholder]

The political cartoon depicting the soldiers cross's  sorta says it all. ROE are a political gambit the commanders on the ground must  accommodate- Sadly they generally end up getting more Americans dead  because they are primarily drawn up by politicians for the appeasement of the locals.--not our military.

[Eddy Out]

If Obozo manages (thru hook/crook n martial law) to spark off Civil War II...........    do you think there will be ROEs applied then????

[Marvin Green]

This is going to be more screw the troops bs.  Our troops are being murdered by their supposed military personnel and local police.  This is absolute insanity.  This war in Afghanistan would have been over long ago if idiots and sycophants like Panetta had been out shoveling s**t on a mushroom farm, which is the only job he and his ilk are qualified for.  It is a sad commentary on the government of this country that never have idiots like Panetta, Gates, and McNamara been held accountable for the deaths they have caused with their insane policies.  If the day ever comes that the people can take back their country they need to hunt down these b******s, put them on trial, and when they are found guilty dole out to them the same punishments they so unjustly administered to the troops.  If Romney is elected we really need to put the pressure on to have all of the troops who have been court martialed for doing their job given full pardons and their records wipe clean, put back on active duty with all their back pay, and all the promotions they would have received while falsely imprisoned.  We also need to put pressure on to clean house in the Pentagon and get rid of all the politically correct hacks that have been allowed to ruin our military under the current regime.

[Michael K. McCloud]

 Quite a few, more experienced veterans than I, have explained before this, the problems with a policy of ' counter-insurgency ' combat reaction. It's a basically flawed response, it needs to be dropped, it invites endless, open legal issues such as we see being studied here. We were hobbled by this crap in RVN, &, I've heard; Korea as well. ' Permission To Fire ' is an implied policy whenever the mission is defined & given the green light; someone is going to die. I don't believe the apparition of this study of legalities in  foreign countries engaged in active combat, being applied to our, USA citizenry, or our entangled, but,Constitutionally defined legal system would ever appear. ' Unless ' martial law upon the citizens of the USA were imposed. BIG mistake, We would have every Right, guaranteed-not ' granted ' by the Constitution, to fire, fine & can, each & every one of our HIRED HELP (!) that threatened their employers-US(A), with assault; with intent to injure & deprive of their civil &Constitutional Rights.  Maybe the best approach would be to release all, wrongfully convicted political prisoners; military or civilian  and have their place taken by a sham politician-wonder how they'd like that ' policy ' ? ( ' Butt ' , that would, by The Law of The Land; be wrong, & ' We The People ' DO know the difference, even if those we hire, demonstrate, at times & not all, that they do not ).  Remain observant & informed, regard all news rationally &carefully. Thank You, all   Mike