What would you do if you where outside in your yard and all of a sudden you heard a helicopter and it sounded like it was 2 about 2 miles away and coming in your direction at about 800 feet high



PFA has alot of new members so I am writing this reminder....
I delete all off topic comments. If you want to talk about something other than this post, then you need to start another discussion.

Another very important reminder! Never ever tell online what you have as far as weapons, ammo nor any supplies. And definitely never give away your bug out location.


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I hope it    is not too late to purchase guns and ammo, I just have not had the money.

Go to your local Pawn shops,garage sales and get documentation so there is a trail of purchase, but like my friend said tell know one of who,what,when or where regarding anything you buy or have or plan to do. Protect your self by doing the right thing and for the right reason.

This statement sound like a contridiction to me and are you sure you stated that correctly to make sure you have a purchase trail ? I have just heard rumors that some people have bought guns and they are not resistered to them ? Now this would be against the law but at the same time the law would not have a record ? I would never suggest breaking the law ! I was just sayng I have heard rumors of people doing just this very thing ? Buy fire arms that are not registered ? I would never break the law and I am sure no one on this forum would do this . But I have heard rumors . Those snecky law breakers ! They will have illegal guns and the Govenremt will not even know about those guns purchased with out a paper trail ?

One think is for sure and proven in many countries, including US. Registration will ultimately finish in confiscation. Make your choice.

I believe there is confusion between "registered" and FBI Background Checks...To my knowledge, firearms are NOT registered in the United States, yet...I also believe that the FBI must, by law, destroy, after 30 days, all records of Background Checks regarding Firearm Purchases...

The receipt you receive from the business selling the firearm is not sent to any government agency, yet...The info is kept on file so the buyer can be identified if a crime is committed with the firearm and law enforcement can trace the serial number to the dealer...

IMHO, the LAST thing you want is a "paper trail"...Law abiding citizens don't need it and the criminals don't care what the law is...

Semper Fi, Dwight   

Dwight, you are dead right, a paper trail does no good for you, and while the receipts are not supposed to be sent in, and to my own knowledge, have not been yet, they must be kept by the selling business as long as its in business, and the BATF has the right to inspect any firearms registered dealer at any time without notice, to ensure they are fulfilling the law.

    It is and has been illegal for anyone to look at those records until a crime has been committed, the buyer of the gun is a suspect, and their is probable cause to believe that specific gun was used.  Only then can they get the data legally, and by this, take the firearm for testing, and must return it if it proves out not to be involved.

     On the other hand, for the past five years, BATF agents have illegally gone into specific gun shops on the premise of an unannounced visit, and while they have the right to inspect the files, to ensure they are properly maintained, they may not take any specific data from the files without a court issued warrant for a particular firearm.

     They have had many shop owners make copies of all purchases of the past thirty days, and similar time frames, with the threat of shutting down the shop, and finding anomalies and have strongarmed the compliance of owners in violation of the law.

     It is entirely legal to buy a gun privately if one is legal to own it.  It is illegal to buy a gun with the intent of transferring it to someone not legal to own it, but it is perfectly legal to sell a firearm to someone you have reason to believe can legally own it, and there is no law requiring or even enabling you to do a "background check".

     Every nation which has conducted a full firearms registration process has ended up confiscating all the weapons registered.  That is how Russia was disarmed, with the Bolsheviks fighting the peasant militia some three years after the revolution was complete.  The Czar and aristocracy was defeated and fleeing gone, within three days of the start of the revolution.  It took almost three years for the Bolsheviks to run the militia out of ammo, and shoot them down.

     They chased them to the outskirts of Moscow where they'd hoped to have the backing of the Muscovites, against the Bolsheviks, but a deal was made in secret, the city leaders promised if they stayed out of it, they would keep their guns, keep their citizen status, and be part of the ruling minority.  They agreed, and didn't back their fellow citizens, and after the Bolsheviks finished with the peasant army, slaughtering a third of the people, they marched the Muscovites out, "registered" their guns, sent the people one way, the guns never re-appeared, and the funny thing, was the Bolsheviks didn't keep their word.

      In the past six years, gun sales, manufacture, and supplies of ammo have consistently been up 40% over the last year of the Bush regime, and that percentage has maintained every year since.  There are more than twice as many legal guns in citizens hands than six years ago, and the sheer number has reached a point it scares those pursuing control.

      We are Sovereign Citizens, and we are the authority over government.  We must restore our own confidence in our Sovereignty, and we must reclaim the fact we allow government to operate by our consent, and we have the right to withdraw our consent when ever we feel the need to.

     We live with a government which utterly refuses to toe the constitutional line since "Teddy" Roosevelt, we have had a fascist government form ever since, and all the "ists" forms are iterations of the fundamental premise of Marxism; the focus is solely on revolution, with only implied means of governing after the overthrow, and by this fact, and the reality in the world, socialists, communists, Marxists, fascists all are the same people, they have chosen revolution to change government, but there is no "matrix" for socialist government only suggested ideals.

      There was a Russian "Politburo" however members were appointed by those in power.  There never was a USSR, it was cover for a Russian Empire, ruled totalitarian, and it is only the fact the lowest ranks in the government figured out they were no more than totalitarian, and completely broke, that allowed for the fall of it, and the certainty Russians have that communism and socialism aren't political in action but are tactics and strategies of war, nothing more, nothing less.

     For this reason, we should carefully listen to Vladimir Putin, and the many Russian, and former satellite nations outspoken leaders, because they have been where we are going, Russia was instrumental in installing socialists in our government and supporting the movement left, so they are seeing us continue on the course their dictators set, and they all know the end that it will be, if we don't turn around and run back to our original form, the republic, under the constitution.

    It is said, "the wise man learns more from the fool, than the fool ever learns from the wise man".  Vladimir Putin may be many things, and we might not want him as president, but when he says we don't want communism, he is not a fool, and he knows better than most of we who have actively fought and studied American Communism, what has been done by his predecessors, to push us this way.  You don't have to like the man, although I do, and respect him, to take lessons from him.

     To conclude, there is no good reason to ensure a paper trail, and every good reason to avoid one if possible, because no government has ever been trustworthy.  We have the absolute right to own "every terrible instrument of war", as Thomas Jefferson stated unequivocally, as the second amendment belongs as "the enumeration of one of our Unalienable, or Natural Endowed Rights".  It is not the source of that right, it is only the written enumeration of it that it should never be disputed as being natural.

    The Dick act of 1902 was passed by Congress in that year precisely because the constitution states our Nation shall have no standing army.  Our sole fixed and permanent military is the Navy, established in the Constitution, and the Marine Corps, also established as the fighting force to ship aboard the Navy, for the defense of our borders, the Coasts.

    The Dick act is also known as "the efficiency in militia" act, and it states the standing army remaining from the Spanish American war, which was desired by government to continue, was named "the organized militia", and the State's National Guard was named "the regular militia", and it reiterated it was on call by the executive, for "national emergencies", and at the same time, it was clarified it could not be used outside the State it came from except if the Nation is attacked.  This was because state "militias" were called up and used, in violation of the constitution, fighting in the Spanish American war.

     "All able bodied citizens between the age of 16 and 45" were named the "irregular militia", pursuant to the original defining of militia at the time of our founding, and in the Dick act, "all the militias have the equal access to all the accoutrements of war", and in criminally enabling a standing army, congress also inadvertently made it an act of congress ensuring "the militia" has the full right and authority for all the weapons of war.

      If any citizen is charged with illegal possession, pursuant to any current law, or future law, with regard to form, type, manner of loading, any aspect of a gun, that person needs to get a lawyer willing to pursue on the premise of "The Dick act of 1902" as no aspect of it has ever been repealed, and as it violates the constitution, a lawyer can turn the court proceedings around on the premise this same act which specifically authorizes "full access by the Militia", in full keeping with its origin, also authorizes a standing army in violation of the constitution.

    The government does not want to have to defend the Dick act, and they get up in arms when it is mentioned, because it highlights the complete illegal form of our current government, and demonstrates in writing, the exact violation of the constitution, which is within a dozen amendments, which have been successfully fought, because the attorney general has been able to establish both the venue and the authority which would declare the outcome.  The sixteenth amendment was never legally ratified, however the attorney general formed an investigative committee, and they found the anomalies in the separate state returns were not "alterations of the amendment" but mere word changes, position of paragraph changes, and these did not rise to the level of "altered original form", even though the constitution states specifically, amendments ratified, must return on the exact document sent identically to all the states, and no changes can be made or that document is null and void, and not ratification.

    Any citizen can pursue this amendment, the income tax, and will find only two states fulfilled the ratification process, every other state altered the document and printed their own copy, with their "minor" changes.

    I personally don't care that perhaps half of my arms are registered, even if such papers were given to government, I am beyond willing to accept any word of government for any reason.  Unless and until government pulls its self back under the Constitution, or we shove it there, and put our foot down, I declare our government an illegal central government in complete violation of constitutional limits, and call all its works null and void unless and until it becomes a constitutional government under the exacting limits of the words, in their original meaning, in the spirit for the purpose they were written, and the one thing sotero has gotten right, the constitution is most certainly a "limiting contract", not document, and its sole purpose was to put an exact limit of federal authority, exactly eighteen duties and purposes, with all other law and authority stated as belonging to The States, and to The People, respectively, as the tenth amendment states.

    The ninth amendment specifies, those rights enumerated are not to disparage others which we naturally have, and the constitution cannot be used to "derogate" such natural rights we have which were not enumerated.

   While we live our lives as "Sovereign Citizens" the sole right which can be taken from us is the "right to life".  We have the ability to hold every other right as long as we are willing to stake our life on defending our Natural or Endowed Rights.  That is the entire intent of both the constitution, and specifically, the rights enumerated.

Semper Fidelis, John McClain, GySgt, USMC, ret. Vanceboro, NC

Thank you for clarifing further!!

Was not long guns registered in NY and later confiscated? Now, if I do buy a gun and if background check is destroyed (if you believe) what is good for? What is good your concealed permit, that is not registered as well? Do you really trust the government?


I'm not aware of NY confiscating any firearms, do you happen to know when it happened?...

The Background Check that's performed, when you purchase a firearm, is just to confirm that YOU can legally own a firearm...Nothing regarding the firearm you are buying is sent to the FBI, just YOUR information...The only thing the FBI knows is that you bought a firearm, no other info...The FBI must, by law, destroy the Background Check in, I think, 30 days however, it could be longer but, not much...

Regarding your question about the Concealed Carry Permit...It is definitely registered with the state that issued the permit...

And finally, you asked "do you really trust the government"?...My answer to that is: HELL NO and you shouldn't either...


I don't know what I would do. I have to think about this.

 That is not uncommon here since there is a helicopter  training field close by..

Amazingly I have had this happened, more than once.

All ya got to do is raise your hand and wave Hi !  - actually HeLL - Oh !!! seriously fear not ;-)

T'is true !!!

Stay well and blessed and your beloveds,~ CK



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